I dont mean that a neural network can complete the work of traditional image processing algorithm.What i want to say is if it exists a kind of neural network can use the parameters of the traditional method as input and outputs more universal parameters that dont require manual adjustment.Intuitively, my ideas are less efficient than using neural networks directly，but I don't know much about the mathematics of neural networks.

CodePudding user response：

If I understood correctly, what you mean is for a traditional method (let's say thresholding), you want to find the best parameters using ann. It is possible but you have to supply so many training data which needs to be created, processed and evaluated that it will take a lot of time. AFAIK many mobile phones that have AI assisted camera use this method to find the best aperture, exposure..etc.

First of all, thank you very much. I still have two things to figure out. If I wanted to get a (or a set of) relatively optimal parameters, what data set would I need to build (such as some kind of error between input and output and threshold) ? Second, as you give an example, is it more efficient or better than traversal or Otsu to select the optimal threshold through neural networks in practice?To be honest, I wonder if this is really more efficient than training input and output directly using neural networks

For your second question, Otsu only works on cases where the histogram has two distinct peaks. Thresholding is a simple function but the cut-off value is based on your objective; there is no single "best" value valid for every case. So if you want to train a model for thresholding, I think you have to come up with separate models for each case (like a model for thresholding bright objects, another for darker ones...etc.) Maybe an additional output parameter for determining the aim works but I am not sure. Will it be more efficient and better? Depends on the case (and your definition of better). Otsu, traversal or adaptive thresholding does not work all the time (actually Otsu has very specific use cases). If they work for your case, excellent. If not, then things get messy. So to answer your question, it depends on your problem at hand.

For the first question, TBF, it is quite difficult to work with images in traditional ANNs. Images have a lot of pixels, so standard ANNs struggle with inputs. Moreover, when the location/scale of an object in the image changes, the whole pixel data changes even though the content is the same (These are the reasons why CNN's are superior to ANN's for images). For these reasons it is better to use processed metrics which contain condensed and location-invariant information. E.g. for thresholding, you can give the histogram and it returns a thresholding value. Therefore you need an ann with 256 input neurons (for an intensity histogram of 8bit grayscale image), 1 output neuron, and 1-2 middle layers with some deeply connected neurons (128 maybe?). Your training data will be a bunch of histograms as input and corresponding best threshold value for each histogram. Then once training is finished, you can give the ANN a histogram it has never seen before and it will tell you the optimal thresholding value based on its training.

what I want to do is a model that can output different parameters (parameter sets) based on different input images, so I think if you choose a good enough data set it should be somewhat universal.

Most likely, but your data set should be quite inclusive of expected images (in terms of metrics and features), which means it has to be large.

Also, I don't know much about modeling -- can I use a function about the output/parameters (which might be a function about the result of the traditional method) as an error in the back-propagation by create a custom loss function?

I think so, but training the model will be more involved than using predefined loss functions because, well, you have to write them. Also you have to test they work as expected.